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Nope - Tactical Ninja

Sep. 21st, 2014

07:17 am - Nope

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In good times, people tend to vote left. In bad times, people tend to vote right. 49% of NZ just voted right.

Under MMP, this means a centre-right coalition will be formed and we'll get another 3 years of increasing inequality, increasing unemployment, and increasing national debt. I will be ok because I am in the demographic this government looks after.

But I didn't vote for this and I am utterly disgusted at what it says about the values of my fellow kiwis. And because it's about values, it's personal. Essentially, if you voted for this government we do not share enough values to sustain a friendship. Hardline maybe, but I am done with the unthinking, unfeeling majority (which, like Scotland, is barely a majority) being ok with a sociopathic forex trader shafting our country's vulnerable for the profit of his rich mates. I won't associate with that. I can't, not and live with myself.

Comments:

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From:danjite
Date:September 20th, 2014 08:06 pm (UTC)
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Activism or exit?

If the former, interested in strategic & tactical discussions.

If the latter, we'll visit.
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From:tatjna
Date:September 20th, 2014 08:45 pm (UTC)
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Next Finnish legislature election is in 2016 I think. Since folks there say that Finland is also swaying to the right, I might stick around and see what happens there (and get my language up to immigration standards) over the next couple of years.

But yes, I want to keep working at improving NZ for the time I'm here, however long that is.

I am not interested in going into politics myself.
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From:danjite
Date:September 20th, 2014 08:54 pm (UTC)
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Does "not going into" also mean "not being active in"?

I am trying to figure out my next activism. My big concern overall is victims of bad government, which especially means kids living in poverty and, generally, anyone who attends a public school in a non-posh neighbourhood.

This is outside my field, outside my previous activisms and seems chocca with lots and lots of people with agendas that have nothing to do with kids or outcomes.

I don't know how to approach it or even whom out there is like minded.

For the most part, I see poor kids being blamed for being poor. I do not have words to express the rage this gives me, but I must use it for good.

I do believe in objective good.
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From:tatjna
Date:September 20th, 2014 09:14 pm (UTC)
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I am always active, but have zero interest in aligning myself with a party or becoming associated with a particular lobby.

My skills are mostly in facilitation of consensus and persuasion, and that's where I think I can make the most difference.

I am more interested in changing attitudes that drive policy than acting as an ambulance for the results of poor policy.
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From:tieke
Date:September 21st, 2014 08:16 am (UTC)
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These guys are worth supporting, if you don't already:
http://www.cpag.org.nz/
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From:morbid_curious
Date:September 21st, 2014 11:26 am (UTC)
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I think I'd like continuing to do what I can to help make education work better for people. Whether it's policy or education content or systems. I'm wonder if there's more that can be done around open government, big data and privacy, though I have fewer immediate options of things to do in that sphere.
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From:tatjna
Date:September 20th, 2014 09:29 pm (UTC)
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Good to know. Thank you.
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From:crazedturkey
Date:September 20th, 2014 09:09 pm (UTC)
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Sorry and solidarity from across the pond.
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From:tatjna
Date:September 20th, 2014 09:28 pm (UTC)
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Thank you.

My respect has been restored somewhat by checking the results for the electorates in and around Wellington. Not one of them voted in a National candidate.

Which leads to the question - if the people living and working in the seat of government, who often work for the government and are closest to where policy decisions are made, don't want National representing them, what does that say about National as a government?
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From:du_secondaire
Date:September 20th, 2014 09:35 pm (UTC)
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THIS. I'm very sorry to hear about your whack-assed politics and totally dumb voters (I empathize - we've got our share of them here in the US too). I hope it swings back the other way.
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From:tatjna
Date:September 20th, 2014 09:41 pm (UTC)
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One thing's for sure, they don't get to blame the previous government for their fuckups any more. Or the GFC.

And historically, three terms is about the limit for kiwis before everyone suddenly goes "Time to give the other side a go now."

I think that's our version of egalitarianism these days.
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From:ecosopher
Date:September 20th, 2014 11:21 pm (UTC)
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I read this last night before I went to bed and thought of you. I'm so sorry <3 We had 11 years of John Howard so I can totally empathise.

Unfortunately I see it going right everywhere; with the whole ISIS thing, people are easily convinced that the right can protect them better than the left. And they're prepared to give up more of their rights, too. I hate that this is happening.

Unless our liberal side convinces the public that they're a viable option compared to the conservatives, then our current govt will be back in in two years as well. And they're basically shitting all over all of us who aren't wealthy businesspeople.

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From:richaarde
Date:September 21st, 2014 12:36 am (UTC)
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Around here, the party that ends up elected is the party that isn't in power. Whenever one party wins the Presidency, the other party ends up winning a disproportionate number of Governors' offices during the next three years. Funny, that.
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From:tcpip
Date:September 21st, 2014 12:51 am (UTC)
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Results are pretty much as the opinion polls expected, tho'.

My reading is a lot more than 49% of NZ voted right. Of the right-wing parties I would include National (47%), NZ First (6.5%), and the Conservatives (2.5%).

Indeed, given that these results are very similar to the elections of the previous six years, one is tempted to say the majority of NZ seems to have settled into being a centre-right country that seems comfortable with public asset sales, spying scandals and the like. As long as it all doesn't affect them, of course.

I suspect that National will change its leader in this coming term to create a pretense of "freshness" that will deliver them another election in 2017. It'll be 2020 before there's a chance of a Labour-Green government.
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From:tatjna
Date:September 21st, 2014 12:59 am (UTC)
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Actually, given that this was another low in terms of voter turnout, it was 49% + the 9% that voted for Peters (is there even anyone else in his party?) - of the 77% who voted. Which is less than half the eligible voting public.

However, it's those that vote that count and you're right about that majority.

I didn't actually think Key would make it to this election, and I am sure you're right about him clearing off. He's done his job now. However, no government has lasted more than three terms in NZ in my lifetime, and since this government can no longer blame the previous government or the GFC without even its own supporters going "Bullshit" (such is kiwi culture) - and since they now think they have a mandate, they will likely trip themselves up in the next term.

Maybe I'm just an optimist, but I predict a change of government next time round, especially if Labour gets over its chickenshit and puts Grant Robertson in as leader.
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From:tcpip
Date:September 22nd, 2014 05:53 am (UTC)
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I hope you're right about Grant. When a major party is in the doldrums it makes jolly good sense to put a firebrand on the podium.
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From:pythia
Date:September 21st, 2014 05:32 am (UTC)
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I'm pretty devastated by this result. I can't believe National won enough to govern ALONE. Especially after what seemed like a particularly strong campaign by the Greens(given how much of a minor party they normally market themselves as and how mainstream they went this time), and the amount of people I personally knew who were voting Green when they hadn't previously voted for them.
A whole bunch of dodgy stories are cropping up about people double voting etc. and I'm not sure how much to believe.
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From:bekitty
Date:September 21st, 2014 07:46 am (UTC)
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The whole "voting fraudster" story sounds suspiciously similar to the "benefit fraudster" stories that you hear. Everyone "knows" someone (or saw a post on facebook) who's Done It, but the actual incidence is tiny.

Voter ID laws are a tool of conservatives to disenfranchise vulnerable members of the population, who historically tend to vote for more progressive parties and candidates. Stronger ID laws won't help raise voter turnout; they're more likely to lower it if anything.
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From:t_c_da
Date:September 22nd, 2014 09:12 pm (UTC)
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The only way to improve the voter turnout is to make it compulsory (as in Australia) and tighten up the way a vote is cast to remove double/multiple voting.

The way the Aussies do it has two benefits; 1) a double vote becomes immediately apparent at vote confirmation, and 2) one's vote is entirely confidential (unlike here & the UK, where your ballot paper is numbered and the number recorded against your entry in the register of who has cast which ballot - required to eliminate the second vote you cast).

I personally do not like the fact that the vote I cast can be traced back to me, which allows "them" to track who does and does not support them. My father, when asked how he voted, always replied "in secret, courtesy Her Majesty's Government" - this does not apply here in NZ.
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From:fushia_darkness
Date:September 21st, 2014 08:48 am (UTC)
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The right wing extremists are winning ground in Sweden too, at the same time as the liberal right wing parties lost the election after 8 years ruling. The left wing is trying to form a government but hasn't majority on their own so it will be a weak government and will mean coalitions between the wings in major issues. None of the parties want to work together with the extremist party, and the extremists came out as third biggest party in the elections last weekend. It's crazy how they've grown so fast, it scares me.
The politicians are still struggling to make agreements and find a way to organize a government. I was hoping for the green party to become third, but they even lost voters compared to the last election. I don't understand how people are thinking anymore. Living conditions are so good in Sweden, one of the best compared to other countries, and still people continue to whine about how things are bad and how we should stop take on more refugees. A terrifying development in this little country.
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From:tatjna
Date:September 21st, 2014 09:59 pm (UTC)
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That right-wing extremism thing is a growing trend in your part of the world, and it's really concerning.

The Nordic countries are about the only ones that have it better than NZ, and it's because the politics tend to be further to the left. I don't understand why this isn't plainly obvious to my fellow countryfolk.
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From:brynhilda
Date:September 21st, 2014 09:50 am (UTC)
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Oh no :(.

We have some trouble with a right-winged party called AfD (Alternative für Deutschland)overhere. They of course claim not to be right-winged, but they are.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_for_Germany

..and of course people started to vote for them in certain elections like crazy.
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From:tatjna
Date:September 21st, 2014 09:58 pm (UTC)
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Yeah. The extreme right wing parties in NZ tend to get laughed at more than anything. NZ First is probably the most right-wing that gets actual seats, and that's mostly because of their policy on immigration rather than any kind of real extremism.

NZ is the land of "she'll be right", where nobody can be arsed being too extreme and we're too lazy to get out of the water as it slowly heats up.
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From:kehleyr
Date:September 21st, 2014 11:01 am (UTC)
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:-(
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From:(Anonymous)
Date:September 21st, 2014 11:25 am (UTC)
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I am in the position of not being able to un-friend national voters as the majority of my family voted national and all have very good reasons as to why they did so. It has been very interesting talking to them about why they voted the way they did. My Dad for example is an Arable farmer, he voted national because they are cracking down on the dairy sector, and as a by product they are also cracking down on Dad. He went for National though because if Labour got in with Greens at their side then the crack down would be so extreme that crop farming would no longer be viable and he would have to sell up. Now this is a farmer who owns the farm outright so the thought of selling due to a lack of viability is crazy. I respect my Dad's choice, its what affects him most so that's the way he voted. Ironically he doesn't understand why I voted Greens - Greens are a farmers worst nightmare so he thinks that as a daughter of a farmer I should not be voting for me. I reminded him that I'm a teacher so I vote on different policies. We agreed to disagree.
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From:tatjna
Date:September 21st, 2014 09:53 pm (UTC)
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I guess it's unrealistic of me to hope that people will consider things outside their own self-interest when voting.
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From:empresskylon
Date:September 21st, 2014 11:26 am (UTC)
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Argghhh I just posted a lovely big comment and discovered I was not logged in. Mine was the post about the farmer for a Dad :)
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From:siobhan63
Date:September 21st, 2014 01:34 pm (UTC)
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"But I didn't vote for this"

But you guys use MMP!!! That's supposed to always guarantee that everyone gets exactly what they vote for!!! At least according to all the electoral reform zealots in Canada.

The "I didn't vote for this" is always heard here because we use FPTP, and so many of my fellow Canucks think that if we just changed voting systems, they'd never have to endure a gov't they didn't like every again. Which is not to say that I don't think we need electoral reform, I just find it odd that those on the left (because they're always keener about electoral reform) think it will mean an end to conservative/centre-right governments. I guess they just don't pay much attention to election outcomes in other countries...
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From:tatjna
Date:September 21st, 2014 04:59 pm (UTC)
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What MMP has done for us is allow the growth of minor parties into political forces that have a voice. The Greens, for example, are now a major party that took a third of the vote in my electorate, and have 13 seats in Parliament.

Most of the governments since MMP came in in the 90s have been coalitions, which claim to keep governments honest but often involve bulldozing by the main partner.

I like MMP better than FPP because while it doesn't guarantee I'll always like the government, it does mean a vote in line with my values is no longer wasted.
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From:meri_sielu
Date:September 21st, 2014 06:05 pm (UTC)
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Right wing extremist parties are a thing that's on the rise here in the UK with UKIP gaining a worrying amount of seats in the last local elections.... it makes me genuinely terrified of what will happen when we have our general which is next year I think. :(
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From:tatjna
Date:September 21st, 2014 09:55 pm (UTC)
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That right-wing extremism thing seems to be gaining ground all over the EU from what I can see from way over here. It's concerning.
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From:goddessofchaos
Date:September 22nd, 2014 09:58 am (UTC)
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One of the reasons I hoped Scotland would become independent is that right wing politics is on the rise in England and I didn't want any part of it. Scotland is traditionally socialist and fairly liberal, but we're now left tied to a country which is becoming increasingly intolerant, racist and hostile towards the disadvantaged in its politics. I hate it.
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